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93 comments:
what movies have you seen that have affected your actions or thoughts?
what does everyone think on the 1st amendment in this situation?
Why does Hollywood chose to make such violent movies, and why do people enjoy watching them?
I think that it doesn't really matter if children under 18 are allowed to buy video games because mo matter what they will find a way to play it. Similar to R rated movies, several teens under the age of 17 still find a way to watch them
I don't think that the gunmen in the Columbine shootings should be considered victims because they choose to kill themselves. I think that the gunmens families could be considered victims because they lost part of their family.
aaronw- I dont think that it should protect the video games because it is pure violence and the first amendment is ment to protect and help the people of America.
i agree with nicole
i've played m rated games before
and i'm only 15
No movies have ever really made me do something I had not alread premediated. So, no, no movies have ever affected my actions. I mean they affected the way that I think but not in a bad way; only like having different perseptions of actors and events.
well as far as the first amendment issue, the fact is that the first amendment does protect the game or movie but the topic in itself is very contivercial.
catm
I think holly wood choses to make violent movies because its interesting. People much rather watch thing blow up and then beople hugging eachother. They make them so convincing because who wants to watch a cheesy movie
Is censorship right, should certain things be censored or should censorship not be allowed?
kristina- true, but it's the freedom of speech
news and video games are different
Aaron- I think that the first ammendment should protect Hollywood because it is freedom to portray our thoughts and ideas even if it is in the form of a violent movie. Some of shakespeares plays are incredibly dark and violent and yet we teach these stories in school
Ray
Is our culture obessed with violence?
How did highschool kids get guns and get them into a school?
kealsey, to go against your thoughts i think they are victims. They where victims of thier own crazy thoughts and victims to the world video games and unreality
aaronw - the 1st ammendment makes this situation really complicated. Even if a peice of "art" like a video game is extremely violent and possibly influences people to commit violent acts, in the United States you can't go halfway in protecting free speech. I think blocking peices of entertainment like movies and video games would lead to a a slippery slope of censorship.
I kind of agree with Jose. Videogames do play a role in people's actions and thoughts, but they don't make a large enough of an effect to be blamed as the only reason of one's violent actions. They must have some prexisting physcological problems, and when the violent tendencies they have, brought out by videogames combine, that could cause a violent outcome, such as Columbine.
Aaron- that is true too, I guess that it is more like freedom of speech and you can have freedom not to watch/play the video games.
Regarding the First Amendment, I don't believe in exceptions to this rule. Once we start making exceptions, it may just start snowballing. The connections between the video games and the shooting is there, but suing the makers of the games is a stretch. Nobody in that company intentionally caused this to happen.
Kealsey, i think our society is not nessesarily obsessed with violence but merley suceptible to our own human nature and the violence it includes
kelseyl- I agree with you. When I think of a victim I think of someone who had little or no choice in what their fate would be. They were the ones who were "attacted". The shooters made the choice to do what they did.
Allison- I'm pretty sure they had the guns in their house. Like hunting guns. I'm not sure if their parents bought the guns for them or they just took their parent's guns, but I'm pretty sure the guns were in their houses.
KelseyL-I definatly where you are coming from. They created the victims therefore they are not one of the victims. But from another point of view wouldn't they be victims of these moviesvand video games? If they were still alive, couldn't they argue that the video games played a role in this massacre?
allisons
i dont really know how they got guns but getting them into the school is just a matter of not letting anyone know and keeping a secret is easey
To go off of what Leslie was saying about a kid being abused by their parents and then they grow up and have kids and end up abusing them, I think that they could go in either two ways with that situation. They could try to make a difference in the world and try to stop abuse and not abuse their kids because they knew how much it affected their lives. Or they could just continue the circle and people will just keep getting abused.
allison~I'm not quite sure how they got the guns, but if their parents had guns, they could easily get at hold of them, and to get inside the school they could easily put them in their backpack
In general, I tend to be anti-censorship. I think that prohibiting a piece of fiction--even a violent video game--makes it more appealing to people who are perhaps already "on the edge." Being a teacher, I think that education is a far better solution to the violence portrayed in the media. I don't know much about the childhood history of the Columbine gunmen (I don't know if anyone does), but I think the true tragedy is that they didn't have anyone to help them form healthier coping mechanisms.
Allison at 17 I believe you can get a gun-carrying perment and/ or you can take a parents gun.
catherine,
Isnt that like saying someone else made me do it?? Is it a way of saying that they didnt do it and the shooting was not their fault? Dont they have to take some responsibilty.
Instead of blaming video games, blame gun laws.
I was wondering if anyone has read the book 19 Minutes by Jodi Piccoult? Its story closely resembles a lot of the issues we're discussing.
I agree with Alyssa, there are thousands of kids play the same video games and they don't have violent outbursts
rachel- I am in the middle of reading that book right now!
I agree with nicole. Something else would have to have a major effect on them, and the video games were just something they do.
People don't just shoot people because they played a game. Something else would have to have the main role in why they did what they did. The video games were just something that they played, and cannot be blamed for what effects they had on the shooters.
to go off the question seth asked about the defing line between ok and not tolerable, i personally think its diffrent for each individual person based on how they lead thier life and thier morals, thats why our society dosent really have a specific line because we cant find a happy mediam
AllisonS-blaming someone else is completely different then calling that same person a victim. The blame is entirely still on those two boys, and yet doesn't it seem as though these boys might be a victim of our violent technology?
Mrs. Leclaire- I agree! I don't think that the gunman would have gone on this massacre, if someone had recognized their physcological problems and how deep they went, could have helped them. Possibly preventing the shootings.
kelsiel~ I agree, I think that a persons past shapes their future and they can either chose to make it for the better or worse
So Ray are we able to censor anything in our society.
This is actually kristina but I have a question for everyone:
Well, this is a society that has messed up things and does not have high morals, so how do you guys think that society as a whole can draw a line in what is tolerable and untolerable?
catem- I think they got the guns from a friend at school. Which is sad because that friend could have told the school about this possible shooting. Correct me if I am wrong.
ray - thats a good point. One of the main reasons we have so many moral ambiguities in our justice system is because each different situation has its own completely unique emotions and mental states. Its almost impossible to find all-encompasing morals, opinions, ect.
catherine~I don't think that the two shooters were victims of the shootings, but they had been victims of bullies, and a lot of times once someone has been a victim, and they don't know how to deal with it, they will make other people victims. That is how most people become bullies.
Car-I disagree, the blame is one everyone. Those boys were tourmented and tortured by random people whether by bullying them or ignoring them. They were lonely and hurt. And even though they went off the deep end and did what they thought they had to do, they shouldn't be blamed-everyone whoever knew them and touched thier lives is to blame, even if that person touched them in a good way.
Kealsey, we cant sensor everything but we can sensor what we believe needs to be and the people who dont want that sensored just simply wouldn't do it.
Kristina
I don't think that our society can really draw that line because everyone has a different set of morals. When people have different morals they won't really be able to agree on what is tolerable and untolerable.
sorry last comment was for Cat
I agree with what Sethd said in the inner circle. Books and movies affect me more because they have a plot. When I watch a movie I find myself applying the story to my life, but when I play video games I do not even give a second thought to what I am doing.
catherine- this is kristina but I am gonna answer your question:
I think that there is a huge responsibility on the killers, it was them who chose to use the violent technology, it is not society who forced it one them. Eventhough society advertizes it, I think it is their mental strength that determines what they do. I really don't think that they were victms at all.
Do you think Grisham is being hypocritical? He did write books that could have influenced people to do stuff. Like Stone says, The Firm could persuade someone to cheat.
if anyone wants more info on the students responsile for the shooting you can go to http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Eric_Harris_and_Dylan_Klebold
I have a question about unnatural killers and sarah
Dont' you think its a bit ironic that she goes along with her boyfriend, but as soon as she got caught and the law was a gainst her she choses to take her own side and put all the blame on him
I think Leslie brought up a really good point. I had never considered the fact that Sarah could have made up some of the story, because she needed something to blame it on because she didn't want to take the blame for her own actions.
i agree with kelsy because people have so many different ideas of what is wrong and what is right that no line can ever really be drawn without severe consequences
kelsyl- that is a good point, do you think that how much it influences them is depending on how strong they are mentally and how they were raised or what do you think?
maddison~You are probably right, I was just saying how it is quite possible for young people to get a hold of weapons.
sorry, im behind the times.
Do you guys agree with John Grisham or Oliver Stone on this issue?
Do you think Sarah's testimony was remotely accurate? And I was a little confused about why she would be sentenced to life in prison when Ben would be sentenced to death row.
Kelsey- Oliver Stone. He had every right to make a movie and put whatever he wanted in it. He cannot help who watches his movie and how they interpret it.
I think that people want to blame movies instead because we don't want to acknowlege that it could be a problem with a society. That it could be the parents fault or even human nature. He just wanted to take the easiest way out by blaming someone else
catem- That is a good point. It is really sad how much kids can get ahold of these days. :(
Bren
I agree because that brings in the first amendment again because it give him the freedom of speech and the freedom of press allowing him to do what he would like.
Kelsey~I'm split between the two of them. I think that the individual in the end chooses what actions they will do, however I do feel that all the gore and murder going on can have an influence. Who do you agree with Kelsey?
Kelsey~I'm split between the two of them. I think that the individual in the end chooses what actions they will do, however I do feel that all the gore and murder going on can have an influence. Who do you agree with Kelsey?
Could Oliver Stone's movies be symbolizing the general idea of war?
Catem
I think that I am leaning more towards Oliver Stone
Clara- if we are talking about those kind of people, why don't we blame the drug dealers or their parents? Don't those things cause far worse problems than just one video game
Kelsey- exactly. You could take any movie or book and everyone would interpret it differently. Like you could take Cinderella and some little kid could walk away thinking that you should lock pretty girls in the attic or something.
Our culture's perception of responsibility and accountability is that people can't take responsibility and accountability for themselves. They have to be constantly blaming someone or something else.
Today, people will blame others' actions on just about anything, but there's really no way to avoid violence. On way or another, everyone will be exposed to violence on the news or in real life, and I don't know any parent that prevents thier kids from watching the news.
I think our culture put too much responsibility on other people and like what kealsey said "where does it end" we cant take responiility foe our actions and will alway defend our selves.
I think that our culture's perceptin it that someone always needs to be held accountable even if it is the wrong person. If someone gets killed, people always feel better if someone gets punished for it no matter who it is really. Also for responsibility, i think that most people don't want to take responsibility for their actions because it is so much easier to blame somone else. They don't want to be held accountable for their actions.
Our culture's perception of responsibility and accountability is a false sense of control. People like to think that they are in control, and sometimes they are, but usually whoever they are "controling" is really not being controlled
Our culture gives responsibility to everyone, and tries to keep everyone accountable. We are quick to blame others but not quick enough to blame ourselves.
People always want to put the blame on someone. But the way our government is set up, especially with the first ammendment, it usually just goes argued over, and then forgotten. No one ever gets officially blamed. But that doesn't stop us from trying.
In our culture, there are so many different mediums of information. You can get it through news, media, people, etc. So I think blame is so hard to pin-point when there are so many different factors acting on us all the time. I think it is easy for people to blame things that are unfamiliar or easy-targets. A parent could say a movie told a kid to do drugs when that same parent could have done the same thing at their age.
I think that our culture will always blame others for anything that goes wrong in your life. Although some people have influences and are factors in how something happens in your life, but in the end your decisions and choices are your own.
I really believe in personal responsibiltiy, like what (sorry) someone else said this generation is not very independant at all. We tend to blame a lot of people instead of taking our responsibility.
In the justice system, I think our culture's perception of responsibility and accountability is to blame whoever you can to escape the consequenses of your actions. I definitely think this is wrong. Individually I hope people have the integrity to take responsibility, but I know sometimes its impossible to resist the temtation to lie to get away with it.
I think our culture’s perception of responsibility and accountability is wrong. We always think that if we take the blame for something then that makes us a bad person, or less of a person. However, I think it makes you more of a person when you can take the blame for a situation. The person who committed the action should take the blame for their actions, yet very few people can take the blame for what they know that they did.
I think our culture's perception of responsibility and accountability depends on the person. Some people will say that responsiblity can be learned over time and not enforce it, while others will enforce it from the very beginning. Therefore, some people are very into blaming the exact person who did the crime, and others will blame everything around it. As for accountability, it is hard to say because so many are split on that desicion. Many people do not want to take the accountability for actions that surround them, so as stated before, it depends on the person.
Yesterday in our discussion with the songs, one of the points brought up was that our generation has a lack of independence. This lack of independeence may also effect one's ability to take responsibility for their actions, therefore, causing them to need something or someone to blame for their own actions. So I think that people in our generation, always try to find something to blame it on because they don't want to deal with the consequences.
Our culture's perception of accountability really points a finger at our materialistic society. And yet we blame video games, movies, systems and laws when it is actually our fault.
I believe that our culture takes the easy way out by blaming and putting the responsibility on only those who actually did the criminal act. I believe that this is completely wrong. For me, those who do criminal are not entirely to blame for every contact with other peoeple have contributed to the way they are. It seems just that Americans blame them just so they do not have to deal with the reality them actually having a part of the reasons behind the crime. For me, it is either everyone is to blame or no one is to blame.
I think that people in our culture are unwilling to take responsibility for many of their actions and try to push the blame off on something else. I don't think in most cases that other people can be held accountable for anothers actions but it always depends.
Our culture's perception of responsibility and accountability is a strange one. If we can blame some behavior we consider "bad" on some outside influence, we will. Despite that, we often haul of the people to jail, even if we don't believe they're guilty. It's sorta a schizophrenic view of justice, responsibility, and accountability.
Defining responsibility and accountability in relation to the Justice System is complicated. Responsibility in the system is the notion of honesty. Accountability is always accurate this way. As long as responsibilities are abided by, only the liable will be punished.
Our culture's perception of responsibility and accountability changes with every person causing the perception to be a complicated one. However, if you generalize, our culture likes to "scape-goat". Meaning we blame/ put responsiblity on something or someone else instead of the true person who comitted the action.
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